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Published - Wednesday, October 17, 2007

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Local Hmong couple loses guardianship of drowned woman's children


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Two of the children orphaned after their mother drowned in the Mississippi River in May sobbed Tuesday after learning they and two other siblings would be sent to yet another new home — this one in North Carolina.

La Crosse County Circuit Judge Todd Bjerke granted guardianship Tuesday of See Her’s four surviving children to Pama Her, of Morganton, N.C., part of the family that has raised See Her.
Bjerke’s decision went against the advice of Ross Seymour, the guardian ad litem, who recommended the children remain with Ter and Alyssa Yang of Onalaska, Wis., who have cared for the children since June 15.

The case represented a clash between two Hmong clans and two traditions — the unwritten customs that govern family relations in Hmong culture and the U.S. formal legal system.

Ter and Alyssa Yang filed the original petition for the children, ages 13, 12, 8 and 5. Ter Yang is a first cousin of Cha Yang, the 34-year-old man who drowned along with Her and two of her children. Their biological father had been murdered in North Carolina.

At Her’s funeral, elders representing each clan — the Hers of North Carolina and the Yangs of the La Crosse area — came to an agreement: the Yangs would have guardianship, according to Hmong tradition.

But two months after learning the Yangs had filed a legal petition for guardianship, Pama Her filed his own petition for guardianship.

Pama Her filled the role of See Her’s older brother as they grew up, although his family never legally adopted her, according to statements in La Crosse County court Tuesday.

See Her and her six children lived with Pama Her and his family in North Carolina for a time before she remarried. In 2005, she and Cha Yang wedded in a Hmong ceremony and moved to St. Paul.

Ellen Frantz, Pama Her’s attorney, argued he didn’t have a voice in the Hmong process that led to the Yangs gaining guardianship.

Money also was raised as an issue. Yang family members said they paid about $71,000 for the three funerals.

Under questioning from his lawyer, Ter Yang suggested Pama Her became interested in guardianship after hearing about $478,000 in life insurance from the deaths.

The Yangs also said the Hers did not participate in search efforts for the bodies and did not remain in La Crosse for the funeral of Amanda Xiong, See Her’s 8-year-old daughter, who also drowned.

Pama Her said he missed the funeral because he had no more vacation days from work.

In his ruling, Bjerke said he had to go against Hmong tradition and culture and look to the relationship established over time — that of See Her with the Her clan.

“A lot of deference needs to be given to the Hmong culture and their traditions,” Bjerke said. “But there are still laws under the U.S. that need to be followed when trying to determine these things.”

In May, relatives of See Her had gathered beside the Mississippi River, praying to spirits to locate the drowned 34-year-old mother of six from St. Paul. Tuesday, many of the same relatives wept with the two eldest children after the decision.

“I’m just so mad,” said K.T., a family spokesperson. “It is hard to comfort them when you know you’re going to lose them.”

Pama Her, whose daughter translated his words, said while he was grateful he had won guardianship, it was heartbreaking to see the children crying.

Frantz said the four children likely would move to North Carolina at the end of the week.

Joe Orso can be reached at (608) 791-8429 or jorso@lacrossetribune.com and Dan Simmons can be reached at (608)791-8217 or dsimmons@lacrossetribune.com.
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jaded wrote on Oct 22, 2007 4:56 AM:

" North Carolina's crimes rate is not even half of what Wisconsin's crime rate is according to United States Crime rates. A happy family of four months or a happy family that these kids grew up with? If you take a child and let them stay with someone for a few months they are gonna kick and scream. Any child would react that way. I am sure they were kicking and screaming when they were taken from St.Paul to La Crosse. These kids never knew the Yang family in La Crosse until their parents horrible accident. Not until June 2007 did they meet the Yang's. If it was your sister's kids, would you allow it? The judge made the right decission based on the histories these kids had have with both families. Four months verse their whole life? "

Darwinism wrote on Oct 18, 2007 9:42 PM:

" This communities idea of cultural sensitivity is taking into account that a 4th offense DUI convict is the only err to a family farm. We acknowledge "their" here in certain pockets of the community but that's it at best. From our "European" perspective the importance of "extended" family is rigidly defined and inflexible. Maybe if we learned from "them" we wouldn't be so reliant on government programs and use the families most have. "

antieverything wrote on Oct 17, 2007 7:08 PM:

" Hmmm North Carolina? Biological father Murdered? I sure hope they did their homework on the home and gang situation in NC. Todd ole boy, I have to say you have let me down. These kids are going the wrong way. Sadly I dont think this is going to hep in thier futures. Its all on you. "

becca wrote on Oct 17, 2007 4:16 PM:

" I have a couple children from a previous marriage and a new husband. My husband has all sorts of family in this area and my closest family is in southern Illinois. If I drown in the river with my husband, it would be mighty kind of my husband's family to take over the immediate care of my children. However, for the long term, I want my children with my family whom they have known their entire lives. (Even though my 13 year old would scream the house down if anyone threatened to take her away from her school and her friends and the life that she has come to know here.) "

Shiner wrote on Oct 17, 2007 2:53 PM:

" Nolyow, good idea about placing the funds in a trust fund. I was surprised when Bjerke was elected and wondered if he were up to the job, and I guess I'm still wondering. Although I do not know the case law and statutes used to decide this case, I do know that judges have a lot of discretion and with the children wanting to stay in LaCrosse and the GAL stating it was in there best interest, I cant' believe that he sent them to North Carolina. Also, what kind of community support will they have there compared to here? "

ellie1948 wrote on Oct 17, 2007 10:42 AM:

" RE'WHEEZER YOU ARE 100% RIGHT HE WASN'T THINKING YA THINK MAYBE GONZALES GAVE HIM A FEW POINTERS SURE SOUNDS LIKE IT TO ME. "

nana3 wrote on Oct 17, 2007 9:15 AM:

" It is pretty obvious why the judge placed the children with the Her clan, they are related by blood. The Yangs are not related to any of the children. If you read the article, See Her married Yang in 2005, only 2 years ago. It is right for the children to live with real family. "

Noobie wrote on Oct 17, 2007 8:29 AM:

" It's stupidity and the beer from Oktoberfest. There are no other explanation for this idiotic decision. Someone remove this idiot from the bench and send him to some cultural immersion classes. Yes, there are US laws in play here, but each culture also have their own laws that they have to live by. Heck, you even have rules under your house which your family lives by. "want to continue their immersion" "

PicklesPlease wrote on Oct 17, 2007 8:22 AM:

" Her is here with her and it was here that her Her was heard...was this story a confusing jumble or what? I need my coffee I guess. "

Nolyow wrote on Oct 17, 2007 8:13 AM:

" Seeing money seems to be involved, make it a non-issue by putting it all in a trust fund. I would hate for the guardians of anyones kids fight to get them just for the money. I am sure we have not heard the whole story as to what was involved in making the decision. "

Nanigrrl77 wrote on Oct 17, 2007 7:52 AM:

" In this day and age, someone would actually refer to Hmong cultural customs as tribal mumbo-jumbo? Perhaps DutchBoy needs to realize that American laws themselves could be considered "tribal mumbo-jumbo", as they are based on the cultural beliefs of our nation. This is a terrible time for this family on both sides, it is not a time to bring out poorly veiled racial and ethnic slurs against those who are different from us...Perhaps it is time to ask yourself why a different viewpoint makes you so uncomfortable? "

Sully wrote on Oct 17, 2007 7:19 AM:

" I am sure the judge put careful thought and consideration into this decision. It seems it was not enough to come to the right decision however. I guess I don't see the point of moving the kids against their wishes, the guardian ad litem, and the Hmong elders. I would really like to hear the judges reasons for this decision. No the surface it appears there are none. What's the point judge? So much for "best interest of the children". "

The Jolly Troll wrote on Oct 17, 2007 6:50 AM:

" I know of cases wherein after the age of twelve, the child's opinion matters as much as the guardian ad litem. Bjerke is an idiot going against the wishes of both the GAL and the children who are old enough to assist in the decision. "

Wheezer wrote on Oct 17, 2007 4:12 AM:

" Unreal! If the children were upset and crying, they obviously wanted to stay here with the Yang's. What the heck was Bjerke thinking? Obviously, he wasn't. "

miracleseeker wrote on Oct 17, 2007 2:31 AM:

" This is an outrage! On so many levels, I don't know where to start. Those poor babies... "


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