Big Spender wrote on Dec 3, 2007 2:51 PM:
" Reply to CaptnTony, re: "America's Constitution is not a suicide pact"...no, but subverting it surely is. Totalitarianism is a far more dangerous threat to America than Al Qaeda, even a nuclear-armed Al Qaeda. Totalitarian 'governments' have killed a quarter billion people in the last hundred years--American Gulags are not far off if we continue down our present path. "Death by Government" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democide "Fascism watch" http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Fascism/Fascism.html "
Fishnuts2 wrote on Dec 3, 2007 12:51 PM:
" Re:pwuensch. Show me who is running for President on the Democrat side and I'll show you a larger threat to personal privacy than the Patriot Act. She probably has your vote already. I know it's difficult to remember the abuse this Country endured under the Co-Presidents of the 90's, but for our safety, we must. "
Michael Welch wrote on Dec 3, 2007 11:25 AM:
" That Feingold is attacked so is another measure of his singular political bravery. The United States has never been a perfectly democratic (or 'republican' for that matter) society; in fact it has only permitted all its qualified citizens (qualified according to the constitution) to fully participate since 1965 when the voting rights act and the anti-poll tax amendment were passed to ensure blacks in the segregated south their right to vote. 'Habeas corpus' IS a constitutional right; the FISA act is a legislative requirement re: the constitutional balance of powers that allows such as telephone surveillance with the proper authorization. The test of constitutional democracy is under straining circumstances; it is 'suicidal' to our constitution to continuously find ways to circumvent it re: Musharraf say in Pakistan or Putin in Russia... "
DJ: wrote on Dec 2, 2007 9:53 PM:
" And this stand is from someone who calls illegal aliens "undocumented workers". What a Joke. The "fine gold" is nothing more than political dross. He wouldn't say sauerkraut if he had a mouthful of it. "
CaptnTony wrote on Dec 2, 2007 8:57 PM:
" re: Big Spender: It is essential that the government surveil for national security purposes such telephone calls, with or without a warrant from a judge, but with the authorization of America's President and Commander-in-Chief, because (1)America's Constitution is not a suicide pact, (2)terrorists have no right under it to privacy in telephoning, (3)an American's usual freedom from warrantless surveillance of telephone calls from abroad does not prevail when the government reasonably believes the telephone calls may involve terrorists plotting to attack America, (4)that freedom is hardly what the Founders considered "an essential liberty" and (5)protecting America from attacks like the September 11 attacks, or worse, is essential, and the time and attention needed to do the job as well as possible should not be wasted or diverted in order to follow time-consuming and,_in_such_circumstance,_needless,_bureaucratic_procedure_when
_it_is_readily_conceivable_that_terrorists_will_attack_American_cities_with_weapons_of_mass_destruction,_chemical,_biological_and/or_even_nuclear,_and_time_is_of_the_essence.
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Michael Gaynor Michael Gaynor (Grassroots at Work) "
pwuensch wrote on Dec 2, 2007 8:04 PM:
" To Fishnuts: Way to go. It only took 5 postings for you to fall back on the old "what about Clinton" crap. Please, make a legitimate argument or keep your comments to yourself! As for the immigration diversion, all of you crying foul will be worse off when we pay more for everything because we "legals" are entitled to better jobs than picking fruit and doing common labor. You can't have it both ways folks! "
Tax Justice wrote on Dec 2, 2007 8:02 PM:
" The death penalty for illegal immigrants who commit murder?
If we support the death penalty for illegal immigrants that commit hideous crimes, then most Europeans who came to the sovereign lands of the America's at the time of the "genocide of Indigenous People" should have been put on trial. "
BrianGSmith wrote on Dec 2, 2007 3:18 PM:
" Dear "Fishnuts2"...I compliment the good work I think Feingold does and you go on a rant about "Clinton" and 600 FBI files. Clinton and Feingold ARE two separate beings, dude. And if Clinton skipped FISA requirements and went snooping in the files of innocent individuals he should be accused and tried and punished in court. "
Michael Welch wrote on Dec 2, 2007 2:37 PM:
" Feingold is indeed 'fine gold' compared to most politicos; Wisconsin ought to proud to have him. The PatAct has been a corrosion not only of our constitutional legacy but of basic morality and humanity; like the travesties of excused official torture and political prisoners held at Guantanamo (the US prez is behaving like Putin in Russia; what's next? an Alaskan 'gulag'?) it's been a shameful six-and-a-half years; we've sold our very American souls to a god of fear. As for the Clinton records -- sure open them up; after all they belong (theoretically at least) to 'US,' not 'them'...
"
Common Sense wrote on Dec 2, 2007 1:43 PM:
" Excellent point, Fishnuts. I would love to hear what Feingold would say about those FBI files in Bill and Hillary's custody. I doubt he has any problem with that. "
Big Spender wrote on Dec 2, 2007 10:39 AM:
" Bravo Russ, for your anti-totalitarian stance against the so-called 'Patriot Act.' Let's not turn America into Putin's Russia--better to be hit by terrorists than to live in a totalitarian police state. Totalitarianism is a far greater threat to your personal security than terrorism anyhow...look at the death toll from Communism alone. Ben Franklin: "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Benjamin_Franklin "
Big Spender wrote on Dec 2, 2007 10:34 AM:
" Why not give the Mexican migrants full citizenship? Since Corporate America insists on abusing them for cheap labor, then full citizenship is the least we can do to compensate. Let those who actually do the work benefit; let's stop this system that throws money at an idle and parasitic global investor class. Americans want cheap food and goods made off the backs of an abused foreign labor class--that's wrong--give these workers what they've rightfully earned: a proper wage with proper health care. "
Fishnuts2 wrote on Dec 2, 2007 10:24 AM:
" Atta boy, Brian, cover for your Senator, but yet not a peep about the NINE HUNDRED FBI files that the Clinton administration collected on private and public citizens. Seems that this happened before the "Patriot Act" was passed. Hello?? "
wakeup wrote on Dec 2, 2007 10:10 AM:
" Immigration is this year's diversion. THE MOST important issues - paying $1 TRILLION (or having our children do) to conquer Iraq and ignoring catastrophic climate change. As long as the Republicans keep this immigration diversion going by publicly decrying illegal immigrants and privately doing nothing to stop their cronies from employing them, they can keep their constiutent war profiteers and oil companies happy. Wake up! "
BrianGSmith wrote on Dec 2, 2007 10:08 AM:
" Feingold was correct in voting against the Iraqi War and his predictions of ensuing post-war chaos have proven right. He's also right in railing against the Orwellian 'patriot act' and I suggest those who have a different opinion haven't a true understanding of US History and the evils of an all powerful state. What's funny is most of these folks probably think "government" can't solve anything and 'is the problem' as Reagan said (while he was in gov't and running for another gov't office).....but somehow these armchair terror experts are 100% sure the same government can handle torture and spying properly. We're lucky to have Feingold. "
R A wrote on Dec 2, 2007 8:58 AM:
" Janet is right, he insults the intelligence of people. It is out right to know who is coming into this country, and the young woman murdered had that right. The legislators just don't get it! The immigration is huge, that is what people care about, along with protecing the country. The Patriot Act is a good thing, we need it and because of it many terrorists have been caught. I am glad there were at least some at that meeting that spoke out, however I dought it did any good. They do what they want not their constituants. "
mullman71 wrote on Dec 2, 2007 8:41 AM:
" Feingold couldn't be more wrong about so many of these topics. I respect his courage to continue to take such strong stands on his wrong opinion but politicians like him are dangerous for this country. He chooses to ignore the enormous threat to our nation from Islamic Fascists by denying law enforcement the tools they need to protect us from these monsters. Then he chooses to reward those whose first act in our country is to break our immigration laws yet he believes that our laws are so important that we cannot modify them to help defeat terrorists. Huh?! "
JanetP wrote on Dec 2, 2007 7:22 AM:
" Feingold insults the intelligence of his constituents. The 'comprehensive immigration bill' was amnesty no matter what he tries to name it. It is ultimately giving a pass to illegal acts. That is not the tradition of a democratic nation and cannot be countenanced.
Do we also give a pass to legal citizens who cheat on income tax? fraudulently receive aid to dependent children? lie to obtain food stamps? We prosecute these offenses every day in courts all over America. Do we carve an exception for foreign trespassers whose first act in the United States was a breach of our law?
Feingold, you are not listening.
"
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