Teiresias wrote on Apr 19, 2008 8:35 AM:
" MK, you claim you were a teacher and then this comes up under your name:
"...has every write to dismiss her from her job."
Wow! "
groucho wrote on Apr 18, 2008 9:38 PM:
" CCS doesn't want anything to do with old teachers, naughty kids, or handicapped kids. They only want the cream of the crop. "
toonz wrote on Apr 18, 2008 7:59 PM:
" Until her dismissal,CCS did not require teachers to be certified through their private school exemption. It would not have been unusual to hire someone with a certification in one area and have them teach in another 28 years ago. Due to declining enrollment, in 2002 several teachers were layed off. The new certification requirements were announced just prior to these layoffs. Teachers with less seniority and lacking the correct certification were retained. Wages of a 28 year CCS veteran are comparable to a 5th year teacher in the public schools. She is too young to collect pension, and has too much experience for the public schools to afford her. Her story deserves to be heard. She was a wonderful teacher. "
Fred wrote on Apr 18, 2008 7:58 PM:
" MK: In your post you say, “if it is discovered that you routinely skip mass on Sundays, or live with your boyfriend/girlfriend outside of marriage, these can and will be grounds for termination. I'm willing to bet something similar happened in this case.” If Wendy Ostland was let go because of not “living and teaching the faith faithfully” as you suggest, why did the Çoulee Çatholic Schools say it was because she was not properly certified? The information as presented in this article does not support your implication that she was dismissed due to her religious practices, so I’m not sure where your notion came from. "
Fred wrote on Apr 18, 2008 6:34 PM:
" No religious school is immune from the laws of the state simply because they are a religious entity. If they were immune, they could potentially violate any state laws including those associated child abuse, misappropriation of funds, discrimination of any kind, environmental protection, and the list goes on. Thus, I am in full agreement with the District 4 Çourt of Appeals decision based on the information presented in this article. "
andy k wrote on Apr 18, 2008 12:25 PM:
" I admire this woman's courage. I would imagine that she COULD have found another job - probably one where her employers treated her better. She clearly loves teaching, and has decided to fight for what she believes in. She has subjected herself to public scrutiny and the vicious, unfounded attacks of people like mk. If I'm ever in her situation, I hope I have this kind of courage. "
andy k wrote on Apr 18, 2008 12:18 PM:
" You people have failed to read your bible. Don't you remember the story of Jesus cutting a lady from his payroll as part of his disciple reduction program? "
mk wrote on Apr 18, 2008 11:10 AM:
" How would you feel if your child's first grade teacher was only certified to teach phy-ed? "
mk wrote on Apr 18, 2008 11:08 AM:
" Where does your sister teach Moderate? I'm sure parents who send their children to that school would like to know about her church attendance. It would be interesting to sit in on her classes and listen to what she teaches. She probably has let slip a time or two that it is ok to miss church once in a while. No wonder church attendance continues to dwindle because youth are misinformed by teachers like this. "
mk wrote on Apr 18, 2008 11:03 AM:
" Moderate it is sad how you almost brag that your sister skips Mass and teaches at a Catholic School. Some role model she is for her students. I'm sure the same type of situation applies to Ostlund. Once the school finds out about your sister's conduct she will probably get her walking papers to. I would rather have my child taught by a teacher in their first year, who lives by the faith, then by someone in their thirtieth year who openly mocks catholic teachings. Once again how can you teach at a catholic school when you defy what the church teaches and stands for? "
mk wrote on Apr 18, 2008 10:56 AM:
" Trust me Anon catholic school teachers pay does not differ that greatly from someone teaching in their first year to some someone teaching in their 30th year. In the school I formerly taught at I made about $4,000 a year less (in my first year) than a fellow co-worker entering her 32nd year. Pay range difference is now where near that of public schools. "
mk wrote on Apr 18, 2008 10:53 AM:
" Correction: Second my second post should have said "Moderate's sister is not living or teaching the faith as she should have" "
mk wrote on Apr 18, 2008 10:48 AM:
" Those of you commenting that the Catholic Schools endorse age discrimination have no clue of what you are talking about. I'm willing to bet that most if not all of you are not Catholic or do not even attend any form of Christian services on Sunday. Trust me hirings and firings in the Catholic Schools are based on student enrollment, and your willingness to live and teach the faith "faithfully". When you sign a Catholic School contract you agree in writing to live and teach the faith. For example if it is discovered that you routinely skip mass on Sundays, or live with your boyfriend/girlfriend outside of marriage these can and will be grounds for termination. I'm willing to bet something similar happened in this case. "
mk wrote on Apr 18, 2008 10:40 AM:
" As a former Catholic School teacher myself I can tell you that the Church fully expects teachers to be role models of the faith. I was released from my job last year because of a decline in student enrollment. I can assure you that this was the true reason why because a fellow employee was retained who has taught at the same school for 34 years. This is not a case of age discrimination. The employee just happened to be in her 50's. If she was like Moderate's sister she was living or teaching the faith as she should have. Therefore the school (a private entity) has every write to dismiss her from her job. What's the point of sending your children to a Catholic school if their teacher instructs messages or lives a life that is contrary to your faith? "
mk wrote on Apr 18, 2008 10:34 AM:
" Moderate your "beloved sister" is very lucky to still have her job. As a Catholic School teacher she has agreed to be a role model of the Catholic Faith to the students she has taught and continues to teach. Its a shame that she fails to go to church on Sundays. It is one of the ten commandments. What kind of role model of Christian living is this? "
Anon writer wrote on Apr 18, 2008 10:06 AM:
" sorry...2002 "
Anon writer wrote on Apr 18, 2008 9:49 AM:
" The article yesterday said Onalaska Catholic Schools, now it's Coulee Catholic Schools. Just wondering...was it even called CCS back in 2003? "
Half Full wrote on Apr 18, 2008 9:19 AM:
" When did the CCS start adopting the policies of Wal-Mart? Anything to save a buck. "
tax justice wrote on Apr 18, 2008 8:22 AM:
" While I can appreciate that 53 seems awfully old, that would eliminate just about every priest in the Diocese, the Bishop, and Mr. Birnbaum. Oh..well, things would finally change in the Catholic Church here in La Crosse--across the US--and across most of the globe.
Happy Retirement! "
Anon writer wrote on Apr 18, 2008 8:17 AM:
" I'm guessing they elected to save $$ by getting rid of some higher paid employees that didn't fit their needs. Her attorneys would like to make it a case of age discrimation, but in the end, she was just a victim of downsizing. It happens. "
Teiresias wrote on Apr 18, 2008 8:00 AM:
" No, "Real World", you're wrong on the facts. The court said the chruch can't fire someone without due cause.
CCS will still be able to discriminate based on many factors, but the courts won't let them discriminate based on age.
Now CCS will need to start calling the teacher in question a lesbian or trump up some morals charge to make her dismissal stick. "
Get Real wrote on Apr 18, 2008 7:56 AM:
" "Real World"- You need a dose of the real world. What is this teacher going to do after giving 28 years of her life to this school? Who is going to hire a 53 year old who only has maybe 9 years left to work? All of us aren't as great as you are and have the kind of job security that you do. Laws are made to protect people from being fired for no reason. Maybe some day when you are fired because a younger better trained person will do your job for 2 dollars less an hour you will have a little understanding of the problem. "
The Real World wrote on Apr 18, 2008 7:35 AM:
" The church can fire and hire who they want, that is why we were given a great Constitution. In the real world, if an employer wants to fire someone they should not have to worry about the government stepping in and violating the employers rights.
I know that is hard for the incompetent people who are protected by a union or lawyer. I am paid what I am worth, not what some union or government thug says someone has to pay me. I must admit, you have sure stimulated the economy in China!
"
poo1981 wrote on Apr 18, 2008 7:28 AM:
" My children had this wonderful teacher. She was a great role model of the Catholic faith and taught it to the kids very well. She also was an exceptional first grade teacher. CCS was trying to find a reason to bring in teachers with less tenure which were cheaper to pay at the time. My child was still in the school and most of the parents were heart broken that she was let go. I believe she even offered to go back to school to get whatever new requirements they wanted at no cost to CCS. They refused. This is why CCS lost so many children for those years at the middle and high school level because of these CHRISTIAN policies. Mine included. Hope she can get back something for the personal suffering after all her dedication of 28 years that she deserves. "
Get Real wrote on Apr 18, 2008 7:00 AM:
" What ever happened to "Do onto others as you would have them do onto you."? It took them 28 years to decide she wasn't a good teacher? It sounds like the Catholic Priests may have stopped but now the Catholic schools are screwing people. "
shoeymis wrote on Apr 18, 2008 6:25 AM:
" I find it very ironic that the same lawyer that has the opinion that the West Salem school district shouldn't be allowed to fire somebody because of discrimination also has the opinion that the CCS should be allowed to discriminate because they are a private school.
You would sure think the CCS could have come up with a better defense than this. If CCS wants to they can hire teachers that do not even have teaching degrees because they aren't held to the same standards as the public schools. "
The Moderate wrote on Apr 18, 2008 5:29 AM:
" My beloved sister has taught in a Catholic School for nearly 30 years. She rarely goes to Sunday Mass. She has three married daughters of which only one was married "in the church". Nice try Jimmy Boy! "
audifan08 wrote on Apr 18, 2008 5:25 AM:
" In this tepid economy, some workers in their 20s and 30s say their age is being unfairly held against them, and new legal developments mean more reverse age discrimination claims may soon be ending up in court. I think all we have here is a case of Catholic bashing. This feminist needs to chill out. "