Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 9:30 PM:
" After Becker was hornswoggled at J&A this last week and last nights meeting until 1:30. I believe I am going to pass the hat a time or two, and see if I can raise enough money to purchase 2, 3, or both egg timers for our Chairman in City government. "
Insightful1 wrote on Sep 10, 2008 8:53 PM:
" Tri-State provides paramedics "dedicated" to medical calls, who continue to respond to medical calls even when there are fires.
If FDs can "dedicate" personnel to ambulance work like Tri-State, then they are not 'available' for fire calls. If so, their expenses cannot be "shared" in the fire budget.
It takes 8 medics to operate 1 ambulance 24x7. At $92,000 annual expense PER firemedic, that's $736,000 annually for just personnel. "
Insightful1 wrote on Sep 10, 2008 8:47 PM:
" The financial results stated at the Committee of the Whole by Manitowoc and Sheboygan represent revenues earned without the full cost of the ambulance service. They only account for the "maginal expense" of the vehicles, equipment, supplies, and training not personnel costs. This is the same "model" presented by the Mayor at the one public hearing (so far). "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 6:33 PM:
" Insider- You might have something there? Like this entrance into the Ambulance business does not have anything to do with job and budget retention? Please, take the time and go to nocityambulance.com "
Insider wrote on Sep 10, 2008 6:26 PM:
" I think council member Richmond might be onto something when she pointed out that the Sheboygan FD (pop 48,800)can do fire/EMS and AMBULANCE with only 77 firefighters and La Crosse (pop 52,000) needs 96 firefighters to operate just fire/EMS without an ambulance service????? "
NoCityAmbulanceCOM wrote on Sep 10, 2008 4:22 PM:
" We must remember this is THE PEOPLE'S decision. I implore you all to make sure you have the information you need to make the correct decision. I continue to provide information on why LCFD should NOT be providing ambulance service at a greater risk and cost to the taxpayer at my website http://www.nocityambulance.com "
Big Spender wrote on Sep 10, 2008 2:18 PM:
" La Crosse is afraid of true democracy: this article and the city administrator issue highlight the fact that most local leaders think a "Father Knows Best" system is best for La Crosse. It's the closed-door mentality at work--and it'll work against the best interests of La Crosse citizens in the long run. "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 1:26 PM:
" "Banging them out of order with the gavel" Strong and wise words from Retreat Moderator Kusch! The business at hand again last night was the referendum, PERIOD!!! Not a synopsis or rendition about a 'one sided' view from area Fireman and out of town. 'Not relevant, you are out of order'! This about whether we should have a referendum. That is why Kusch stated' "Let's get on with it". Last night was not meant to be a forum for the merits or lack of, for a City Ambulance Business. Just some made it that way. Now let'see, who was the Chairman conducting the business? Hmmmmmm 1:30 in the morning???????
Is their attempt to tire everyone out? "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 12:37 PM:
" "get people to understand and the difference between cost/Revenue/Level of service"? From what? I mean come on, really! A bunch of numbers put up on a screen by a Fire Chief by apparently throwing darts with no chance to scrutinize? You call that sharing information, you call that information? We will bring in a very experienced CPA, who owns an Ambulance Billing business with a partner other than the CPA business, and also owns another business with another partner that 'collects A/R. "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 12:28 PM:
" Even if you believe we should 'invest' millions in the Ambulance, How about a Mayor that makes statements like these, aloud and on media air? "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 12:26 PM:
" 2Hoots- Mayors WIZM Interview "The numbers have been determined by Chief Cleveland and the Fire Department and have been determined by studying other fire based systems around the State of WI", "It is a very complex issue. It is not easy to understand. Look at how hard it is in discussions to get people to understand and the difference between cost/Revenue/Level of service. That's one of the reasons we look at elected officials because those people are being educated on this issue. How can you educate 10,000 people in Lacrosse what the right decision is. MY FAVORITE-"I am not sure they are going to make an educated decision based on all the facts". PEOPLE OF LACROSSE! THIS IS PRECISELY WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS ADMINSITRATION AND THOSE THAT BLINDLY BELIEVE THE SAME THINGS. "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 12:14 PM:
" These negotiations were in the closet for near a year. Eventually Tri-State walked away. They came out with a public hearing with two minutes for rebuttal and statements. Then we have had tow City Meetings bullied by out of town Fireman, and unusual time to speak. Now we are supposed to be informed. This a laughable, sadly. As I said, we will go around this Council and Members who have remained mute on these abhorrent rules and events. "
rfield wrote on Sep 10, 2008 12:08 PM:
" 2Hoots,
Please stop making sense. I can't imagine a more foot in the mouth situation. If they really want an educated vote - the fire department would have spoken up long ago to start informing us. If there were a valid argument, some real numbers, pros and cons explained to me, I may be swayed to vote in favor of it. But to deny us a vote because someone failed to do their job and present this properly is criminal. "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 12:04 PM:
" Giving anybody (especially from out of town) equal time compared to other citizens and speakers. Can you imagine them giving me more than the 2-3 minutes allotted in rebuttal and against? Get a clue! The City Council has turned a deaf ear to the overwhelming easily identifiable anti sentiment from taxpayers. They have alarmingly set up forums with hugely a disproportionately segment for anti opinion and facts leaving little for 'Anti' representative's. Then they have the utter audacity to exclaim we are not largely informed. We will go around this Council, watch and join in, please! "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 12:04 PM:
" Isnt it interesting? Becker voted for the referendum? Now lets reflect of recent history, and my posts on this and WIZMs Blog. Previous post here reflect that there has been no Forum for an alternative/Anti City Ambulance Business view, facts, or statistics. In fact BECKER was the Chairman last week that was dry gulched by visiting Fireman from out of town. As I posted earlier this week Chairman Becker was almost rabid for information from Retreat Moderator Kusch from 10:00-10:30. Asking questions what rights he had as Chairman and how to gain control of a meeting? Kusch even contributed great points about dockets, orders of business, and what a gavel should be used for when banging them out of order when they go too long, or get off topic. "
2Hoots wrote on Sep 10, 2008 11:52 AM:
" La Crosse Firefighters: PLEASE INFORM ME!!! If I am misinformed, or lacking information, the time for you to correct that is now. Get me some info - put it in the media's eye so we can all see it. I would sure as heck hate to shoot something down based on misinformation. I've been basically begging for info from the LaCrosse FD, yet get no-where. Help me out in making a competent decision. Until then, my vote is against the city ambulance service.
You've got some convincing to do. "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 11:07 AM:
" On the same lines we saw Fireman, and Union Officials speak with no usual limitations in length inexplicably at J&A last week, and yet again at the Committee of the Whole again last night. Why show up? Instead the legal filing of the Referendum will be quickly followed by a Public Meeting with two ANTI PowerPoint professionally assembled programs. Filled with facts and statistics other than Doyles, Johnsruds, or numbers thrown together by the Chief (not a CPA)? This time for all to view, and others that might want to express an opinion or make a statement will be limited to two minutes in fairness "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 11:05 AM:
" Of course, those against the City entering the Ambulance Business knew the vote last night would be against Raniss Referendum. There is a large consortium forming. Consisting of City Leaders, concerned citizens, and well placed businessman. They will Meet and pick a spokesman this week. Then they will call a press conference and file for a binding referendum against the City entering the Ambulance Business. Followed by a Public Meeting (with parking this time) to share information , and statistics that have to date not been given a Forum to do so. Unlike the UWL public meeting where two PRO PowerPoint programs were shared and all others were limited to two minutes. "
packer backer wrote on Sep 10, 2008 10:47 AM:
" The public pay the taxes, but we can not vote on how it is spent...hmmm where have we heard that before? What is the council afraid of, the people being correct? Hang in there Tri-State, if we were given the chance to vote, which we will not, we would vote for YOU! "
traumacare wrote on Sep 10, 2008 10:45 AM:
" I can't agree more with the comments so far. Note one comment made by fire dept. members or there equally incompetent counter parts has been true! Why can't one specific bit of evidence be presented for the statements made about misinformation etc. It appears as if these "professionals" have nothing more than a middle school attitude of "well it will be different here" or "it just is; I know it is" No evidence, No support, NO CITY AMBULANCE "
medic wrote on Sep 10, 2008 9:38 AM:
" If the FD says the public was misinformed then who's fault is that? The information the public was getting was coming right from the main offices from the City of LaCrosse right? What a joke! "
castafly wrote on Sep 10, 2008 9:37 AM:
" I heard on 580 AM this morning that Andrea Richmond voted for this. I don't remember her exact quote so I won't mention it at this time. "
D. Ray wrote on Sep 10, 2008 9:11 AM:
" The next city elections should be very interesting as long as invested candidates run against the established incumbents. It seems we are ready for a major shift in city government. Any takers? "
Senior Advocate wrote on Sep 10, 2008 8:23 AM:
" They have dug themselves in so deep recently that they have no clue nor willpower to dig out.
The fire dept. is now showing its true color also.
All that remains is to see how the voting public will react. Will they band together and get rid of this bunch or will they be passive as most of the time and sit on their hands and just cry and complain. time will tell. "
Slimey wrote on Sep 10, 2008 8:22 AM:
" Anyone who has taken "Johnsrud 101" should have seen that coming a month ago. Oh well, he will be working for LHI next year anyway. "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 8:03 AM:
" Darwin- You are exactly correct. The County post minutes and Agendas timely. This omission of State mandated information is purposeful. Our City leaders sneak under the State requirement by repeating they have distributed the information and met those requirements. That means you have two choices, going to an acidic Tribune who historically carries their books for them, or you can bother WIZM who gladly will help you, but it is really not their job! This City Administration works below the horizon too often, counts on public apathy too much, and the apparent amnesia of taxpayers. "
Darwin wrote on Sep 10, 2008 7:37 AM:
" Not much of a surprise here.
Well, it's pretty clear that once they're voted into office they don't want any further input. It's ill-advised to tell us we're too stupid to make decisions that affect our own lives. Furthermore... WE PAY YOUR SALARIES! This is an excellent way to create even more animosity.
Might I suggest that the Trib, when reporting on council votes, list those who vote for something, and against it? Then we know how WE'RE going to vote come election time. "
Myturn wrote on Sep 10, 2008 7:11 AM:
" There is no surprise here. The only public hearing and two minutes for anti sentiment. Also as it has been stated before by too many, 'this is about insuring Fireman's futures, numbers, job security and Department Budgets' as they bite off more job titles. BTW, I will get a referendum going on this for April, and it was inevitable. Yes, the people should have a chance to be heard on this. "
rfield wrote on Sep 10, 2008 6:57 AM:
" I don't think it's the public that is "too misinformed to judge the situation accurately." "
frog wrote on Sep 10, 2008 6:48 AM:
" Well its time for Nestor to get the ball rolling now!!!! Good-bye King its been a terrible ride "
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